Episode 56: Lindsey Allen’s Leadership Journey: How a Principal Scaled Influence, Protected Teacher Time, and Boosted Student Achievement

A school changes course when leadership starts by listening and then protects what matters most: time, clarity, and opportunity. We sit down with Lindsey Allen, Georgia’s 2025 Principal of the Year and principal of Walnut Grove High School, to unpack the simple, rigorous moves that drive real results. From ten years in the classroom to district hearings and a Title I turnaround, Lindsey shows how credibility is earned, standards are set, and culture shifts when you hire for belief and hold the line with care.

We dig into his three-part rallying cry, every student should have a meaningful school experience, graduate on time, and leave enrolled, enlisted, or employed, and how it reshaped decisions. That led to expanding AP from five to eighteen courses so students could truly compete for UGA and Georgia Tech, while growing career pathways in construction, healthcare, and engineering to match Georgia’s job market. The goal isn’t a handshake at graduation; it’s a real plan for the next step.

Lindsey also shares why safeguarding teacher time is a leadership superpower: purposeful pre-planning, fewer and better meetings, and a calendar built to be canceled when staff need margin. We talk about mentoring new leaders, reading as a non-negotiable habit, hiring to complement your blind spots, and using tools like StrengthsFinder and DiSC to build a balanced team. Looking ahead, we explore AI as a practical classroom ally, returning hours to teachers, supporting differentiation, and elevating the human work of feedback and relationships.

If you care about educational leadership, teacher time, AP access, college readiness, workforce pathways, and using AI to improve instruction, this conversation is a blueprint you can use tomorrow. Subscribe, share with a colleague who needs a lift, and leave a review telling us the one change you’ll make this week.

Connect with Lindsey Allen:

Email: lindsey.allen@walton.k12.ga.us 

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Chapters

• 0:00 Introducing Principal Lindsey Allen
• 4:00 Early Influences And Teaching Start
• 7:35 Lessons From The Classroom
• 12:55 Guarding Teachers’ Time
• 18:01 Choosing Leadership And Expanding Influence
• 23:06 Hard Lessons: Hearings And Tough Conversations
• 28:31 Turning Around A Title I School
• 35:57 Coaching Principals And District-Level Work
• 40:22 Building A Vision At Walnut Grove
• 46:07 AP Expansion And College Access
• 51:54 Recognition As Principal Of The Year
• 55:44 Mentoring New Leaders And Networks

Transcript

Principal JL: 1:21

Today I am honored to welcome a guest whose work in Georgia has not only transformed schools, but raised the bar for what leadership rooted in relationships, integrity, and high expectations can achieve. My guest is Mr. Lindsey Allen. He is currently the principal of Walnut Grove High School and the 2025 Georgia Principal of the Year. With more than 28 years in education in Georgia's public schools, Mr. Allen has done it all. He's been a teacher, assistant principal, principal at multiple levels. Yes, that's right. Elementary, middle school, and high school levels, he's been he's been there, done that. He's also been a district leader and a principal supervisor. You name it, he has done it. Under his leadership, Walnut Grove High School has reached record levels of performance, the highest graduation rate in school history, and statewide recognitions, including the Math Leader Award and the Literacy Leader Award. This is just scratching the surface. Today we get to unpack his leadership journey, the lessons he's learned, and what drives him forward. Now let's get to the conversation with Mr. Lindsey Allen. Welcome back, everybody, to another exciting episode of the Educational Leadership Podcast. Today I am excited to have the 2025 Georgia Principal of the Year, Lindsey Allen, to join me. Lindsey, welcome to the show.

Lindsey Allen: 3:00

Thanks, Jeff. I appreciate you having me.

Principal JL: 3:03

All right, Lindsey. I'm gonna go ahead. I'm gonna ask you the same question I ask everybody on the show. What inspired you to become an educator?

Lindsey Allen: 3:13

Believe it or not, it was my sister. I'm the youngest of three. My sister is 12 years older than I am, and she started uh always want to be a teacher. And so I was five years old when she started her college career trying to be a teacher. So she practiced on me. And, you know, I really I just love my sister. She's like a second mother to me. And when I got to college, I was a college baseball player and kind of, you know, I really was trying to figure out my way. Believe it or not, I changed my major seven times. And it was, I just I just couldn't figure it out. And my sister came to see me and she said, you know, Lindsay, you've always enjoyed working with students and you like to coach. And, you know, she goes, Have you ever considered being a middle school teacher? See, we always need men in middle school. And she goes, I think you'd be great at it. And, you know, it's again, I she's like my mom. And I said, You know what, Bonnie? That's like a great idea. And uh sure enough, I became a middle school teacher in 1998. Interestingly enough, uh, my sister taught at the same school. It was a very large middle school, over 3,000 kids in Gwyneth County Public Schools and right inside in the metro area of Atlanta. And a few years later, actually, we taught together in the same team, which was really cool. But that's how I got into education, it was really just the influence of my sister. And she was to this day, has just you know been my one of my biggest supporters.

Principal JL: 4:32

Well, that's awesome. I like my youngest daughter is about 11 years apart from the oldest, you know, middle child, not the oldest child, but the middle child. And so that's kind of unique to hear you talk about that because I see that with my older daughter, with my youngest daughter, kind of like, you know, coaching them up or like helping them out and giving them advice. And so I really find that really interesting. Now, you're a middle school teacher. What did you teach in middle school?

Lindsey Allen: 4:59

So I I started off teaching social studies and I did seventh grade social studies, which was like the Middle East, North Africa, uh, that area of the world, South Asia. And then I moved into teaching math. And so for the rest of my teaching career, the next six years, I taught algebra one in eighth grade. You know, it was I loved them both. I really enjoyed teaching algebra. That was that was uh great. And that time Gwynette County was transitioning from eighth grade from ninth graders taking algebra one to all eighth graders taking algebra one. So it was a pretty interesting transition to uh be part of that. And but I I enjoyed it. And honestly, I never thought I'd actually become an administrator. That was that was actually the coaching of the principal that I worked with who saw you know, he saw leadership potential in me and pulled me aside and said, Hey, I I think you can do this.

Principal JL: 5:49

And I thought he was crazy, but I think we all have those moments where you're not like for me, I wanted to just coach and teach. That was my goal, right? I I graduated college, I became a head football coach, and I was a math teacher, and so I was like thinking I had it made, and it wasn't until my my wife's grandpa put that you know, that bug in my ear, and I'm like, Yeah, no, that's no, I don't think so. But uh, here I am, right? So, as a teacher, you know, you you're teaching social studies, you're teaching math. What is something that you learned as being a teacher that helps you with your leadership today? What's something that you could take away and go, this helped me become a print the principal I am today?

Lindsey Allen: 6:33

You know, I I think one thing that I think helped me. Well, number one is I was in the classroom for 10 years. And, you know, and I and I and that that mattered to me. And when I tell teachers that, they're like, oh, okay, because there are a lot of administrators, you know, they have a skinny minute and they're there in administration, and they they have not really experienced the ups and downs and the challenges of the teacher. You know, one thing I'll tell you that my teachers love about me, I'm real funny about pre-planning. When we do our pre-planning schedule, nothing irritated more me more as a as a principal, I mean as a teacher, was all of my pre-planning being taken up by meetings, uh all these things going on. But yet you want me to be ready for open house, you want me to have my lessons ready, you want me to make calls to uh all my kids, but yet you're going to encumber all of my time. And so my my I actually have my assistant principals who, you know, I've been very fortunate. I've I've had 13 assistant principals become principals in my in my career, but I have them actually create the pre-planning schedule, and then I have them calculate how much time our teachers have. And if if when they create the plant pre-planning schedule, if they don't have more than 65 to 70 percent of time free, I tell them to go back and redo it. So there's one example of how that impacts how I think about teachers.

Principal JL: 7:53

Um, you know, that's yeah, I think that's great. I mean, that's awesome because you kind of hit something that I believe in as well. I spent 11 years in the classroom. I feel like, you know, the best leaders that I've seen have people that have gone through the ringer in, you know, doing the work in the classroom. I'm not, I don't want to put down other people that spent three, four, five years in the classroom and jumped to administration, but I think you lose something by doing that. When you actually can say I was in the classroom 10 years or 11 years, you have some more credibility with those teachers when you do hit that role because you could talk about the ups and downs. Like I was in year nine learning things, you know. It wasn't just year one, two, three. I was in year nine, ten, eleven going, man, I can get better at this, I could do better with this. And so I think it's really important to be able to speak to what it's like to be in that classroom. And you taught math, I taught math, so that's a subject kids may not like very much. And so you're teaching kids to try to learn something they necessarily don't want to sometimes. And when you have parents that say, I was terrible at math, so my kids are gonna be terrible. I'm at like they have this defeatist attitude. You're like, no, no, don't do that. And so I really, really like that you you hit that point. And I also really want to echo talking about you don't want to waste your teacher's time with things, you want to give make it productive, you want to make sure if we're gonna do some, there's gonna be a purpose behind it. And I'm really like that as well. To where I'm not gonna call a needless meeting. Um, if I don't have to meet with you, I won't. And if we when we meet, we're gonna do something, it's gonna be purposeful. And so, you to be aware of that and you learn that. And I I I can say I did that as well. I hated going to meetings that were meaningless, and so to have that perspective to hear that is really, really refreshing because not a lot of us, not a lot of people in our position do that, and I really do appreciate that you do that for your staff.

Lindsey Allen: 9:58

Yeah, they're they're worried about saying we did it as opposed to saying they they were able to absorb it and it be useful. And yeah, um, you know, I I that's just one example. I mean, another thing we do too is I built our calendar during the summer. I mean, we put every meeting we we can think of on there because what I've learned is, and I'm my teachers will tell you, I can't tell you how many times I cancel meetings, and you know how much they love it when they get an email from me and says, Hey, we're canceling today's faculty meeting. Uh yeah. And they will tell you, I mean, it it is a big deal if I call a meeting. And they know it's a big deal because I I don't do it. Uh, because it's so much easier to put it on the calendar and then pull it off than it is to put it on the calendar because you're gonna gore somebody somewhere. You know, a coach who's got a plan practice or somebody who was gonna, you know, try to get their test graded, who knows? And so again, I the the one thing teachers never have enough of is time. And I'm really big about them doing the work on company time. So I work really hard and I and not just me, I keep saying I our team understands the philosophy is we are going to guard our teachers' time because it's the most valuable thing they have. It's the only thing that we can't give them more of. And if they can't do it on company time, they're gonna have to do it on personal time. And, you know, with all the coaches we have, all the extracurriculars, all the people serving clubs, that's just more. And so we just that that's just something I'm you know that I'm I try to be religious about is let's not take away our teachers' time. God forbid they have another opportunity to grade some papers while they're at school and not have them take it home. You know, you know, you hear about well, they're you know, they give them all this planning time. And your point is, yeah, they're they don't have to plan all the time, they can sit in their room and grade papers, they can sit in their room and and get get you know get prepared. They don't always have to be meeting with somebody all the time. And uh, you know, I think that's a philosophy that drives me crazy. I'm all about the PLC process, don't misunderstand me. But I'm also about giving our teachers company time to get ready and not have to take it home, if possible.

Principal JL: 12:06

Awesome. I love that. I love that. And so you you also I'm sitting here thinking, like, you know, you talk about you know giving them time, you know, the more time you can give them, the more they can get their work done. And I really appreciate that you do that as well. Something I believe in, and I think that's awesome. I think more people out there need to do that. So, you know, you've been a teacher for a while. You know, you said you're 10 years in the classroom. What inspired you to take that next step? You know, some people like to call it the dark side, but you know, it's not really the dark side. Come on now. It's it's one of those things like you kind of get called into it or pulled into it or tapped on the shoulder. What was that for you when you decided, hey, I'm gonna go from teaching into administration?

Lindsey Allen: 12:51

Well, there was really two things that happened. One was in it was about, I don't know, February 2007. I was actually, uh I I've told the story how many times I we had just escorted our uh students to connections. And I had I had one of the best principals in the world's name is Dr. Richard Holland. He was my principal for 15 years, and we were standing there talking. He and some other teachers, anyway, the teachers walked off, and he and I were just having a philosophical conversation, and he asked me a question. He said, Lindsay, have you ever considered getting into administration? And I said, Why would I want to do that? You know, I love leading my students, I love uh working with my team. And he goes, Well, let me ask you this question Why did you get into education to begin with? And I was like, Well, because I want to influence people and I want to, you know, influence as many students as I can in my career. And he goes, Well, so let me explain something to you. If you're a teacher, your influence is really limited to the kids in your classroom. But if you become an administrator, the entire school, you will be able to influence every kid in the building. He goes, So if that's what you think is your mission, he goes, you really need to get into administration. And I mean, that was like a light bulb going off. I I never thought of it that way. That I had the what if I really wanted to expand my influence, it was, and that was that's my personal mission statement is you know, to make a difference in people's lives by positive influencing their thinking, development, and direction. And if that's the case, then that's why I did it. It wasn't for more money, it wasn't for the prestige of it, because you and I both know there's not a lot of prestige a lot of times. You take on people's problems, but really it was about trying to fulfill what I believe was my mission statement. And so anytime I take a job, that's what I think. Does this help me move closer to influencing more people and making a difference in their lives? And so that that was that was probably the aha moment. The other one was, believe it or not, I had a uh a medical situation not a few months after that that almost took my life, and I realized that I wasn't given tomorrow and that I wasn't necessarily all these dreams and hopes and plans that I had, I wasn't promised those days. And so if I was going to do it, I needed to get into it. And that that's really the two the two events that really happened that got me into administration here. I'm 18 years later.

Principal JL: 15:24

Awesome. Well, I really appreciate you being vulnerable on that. I mean, not everybody goes through those types of experiences and things like that. So I really appreciate that. So you've served a lot of different roles as an administrator because I'm going through your bio, man, we could talk about this, this, this, this. I'm gonna let you pick and choose a little bit. Like, talk about the different roles you have and kind of go through them that led you into your principalship today, and just you know, tell us a little bit about each one. What did you learn from each role, and how did they help you into the next role? Because, like I said, you've done a lot of different things as an administrator.

Lindsey Allen: 16:04

Yeah, it it's it's a little deceiving. Well, I, you know, I was assistant principal for six years with that principal I told you about who influenced me. I ended up being his assistant principal for six years. But I also served as a hearing officer for Gwinnett County Public Schools. So it was actually a dual role that I did. And I'll be honest with you, you know, everything from kind of gets you ready for principals because we have difficult conversations, but nothing's better than being a hearing officer. Uh, and I did over 700 plus hearings for Gwinnett County Public Schools and learning how to, you know, uh navigate those processes. Everything's recorded. You could end up, you know, on the news. I mean, you it was all sorts of stuff. But it really helped me to choose my words wisely. It really helped me to know how to deal with difficult situations, particularly with parents. They're coming into a hearing knowing that they're gonna potentially be combative or they're concerned with the the what how the school's case is, but also working with the school and helping sure, making sure their processes are clean. So, you know, you just had to learn you learn how to have the uncomfortable conversations every hearing. So um, so that that that was a real good training. The other part, you know, I end up Gwynette is a very large system. I end up uh my wife and I end up moving, and my kids, we end up moving down to Macon, Georgia, which is the middle of the middle of the state, which is where I'm actually from. My my father had passed away, and and I'm my mom's only child. So we moved back down there and I took over a Title I school uh that was in the bottom five percent of all schools in the state of Georgia, and it's it's 90% African-American community uh students, and all of my kids were either in poverty or one or one generation out. They were 100% free and reduced lunch. And the school I came from in Gwynette, we were we had a real diversity. We had kids from almost every continent in different languages, everything else. So two very different worlds that I had grown up in making. And what I learned in that school was the importance of believing your kids can do it, and making sure you hire people that believe your kids can do it. And don't look at their skin color, don't look at their background, but believe their kids can do it. The other thing was setting a standard and not wavering. You know, you hear Nick Saban say the standard is a standard. That's exactly right. We set a standard, we held the standard, and teachers, if they didn't want to beat that standard. I had a hundred staff members after that first year, 15 of them, I let them go. Because they didn't want to work with our kids. They wanted them to be looking, look, do like them or be like them. That's fine. You need to find somewhere else to do it. And we hired the right people, we created the right culture, we taught our kids, we believed in them. And within three years, we were the distinguished high progress middle school for the state of Georgia. And, you know, our kids were getting high school credits. They never thought they'd get it. We we had kids walking out of high school, I mean middle school with five high school credits. They never even thought about doing that. But it was all about, again, setting the standard, believing those kids could do it, building relationships with their parents. You know, that that was that was probably one of the most rewarding jobs I've ever done. It was a little tough. It was a fight every day for different reasons, but it was it was really rewarding. I end up while I was there, I worked for the national superintendent of the year, Dr. Curtis Jones. And he pulled me to the district office. We had 12 uh secondary schools, and he asked me to help them kind of do what we did at our school. And they had we had great great principals all across Bibb County. We just you know needed some guidance. And so I worked with them. I spent two years working with the University of Washington Center of Educational Leadership, them developing me as a principal supervisor, which my job was really just to help develop principals and their leadership capacity. Love doing that. Then my we had an opportunity to move back up to North Georgia where my wife's from and her family's from. And uh my mom ended up getting remarried, and so she was okay. And uh we moved back and I worked at Buford High School for a year, and then we transitioned over to where I am now in Walnut Grove High School. So those eight of those so 12 years as a as a as a principal, past seven of us as a high school principal, but I've done all three levels. I've even been an elementary, an elementary school assistant principal, which after 11 months and three weeks, I was like, I'm going back to secondary.

Principal JL: 20:17

It takes special people for those elementary jobs. I'll tell you, yeah.

Lindsey Allen: 20:22

And as soon as you realize maybe you're not that, it's okay, you know.

Principal JL: 20:26

Yeah, no, I mean I love like I've been a like 712 principal in Nebraska, so it's like a middle school, high school, and rural schools, you know, I've done that. And so what I liked about that is taking my seventh and eighth graders and getting them whipped into shape. So when they come to when they get into the high school side of things, they already know, like, okay, this is for real and all that. Hard for me now being a 9-12 principal is like bringing in those freshmen and go, hey, we have a standard here, we have things we gotta have you uphold, like we have expectations. No longer can you just get by because in Nebraska, you don't you don't have to get credits, you just get pushed on until you hit freshman year, and then you have to get credits all the way through. And so yeah, we have that issue, and that's statewide, which I really think is something we should change, but I won't get into that. It's another conversation we could spend hours on. So I really appreciate all the different things you've done. That's really cool. I've actually ate at the Waffle House in Macon, Georgia. Really? Yeah. So I'm driving through the whole great state of Georgia, going down to Florida. Um my oldest daughter did a talent comp not. Talent search type thing. I'm in Orlando. So we drove all the way down from Nebraska. It takes about 24 hours to do it. But we actually drew drove through Tennessee, down through Chattanooga, which is really pretty, and went through the whole state. So yeah, like that was the first time my wife, my current wife now ate at a Waffle House, was in Macon, Georgia. And I'm like, dude, because I was in the military. So I was up and down the eastern seaboard in South Carolina, North Carolina, all that. And I'm like, oh, dude, waffle houses are the bomb. We gotta go. The closest one to us right now is Kansas City. So anytime we go back towards the my daughter lives in Kansas City now, where she's a school teacher, we go back, I hit up a waffle house while I'm there. So that's the closest one to us. So yeah, there's a little bit of history there for you.

Lindsey Allen: 22:26

Yeah, there are waffle houses everywhere around here.

Principal JL: 22:28

Well, no doubt. It's like the thing, right? It's like a gas station there.

Lindsey Allen: 22:32

It is, it is, it is. Uh, and I'll tell you what, you can it is fantastic. I mean, you know, you can like get whatever you want. You can you can even get a stake there if you want one.

Principal JL: 22:40

Oh, yeah, oh yeah. Like my first time going to a Waffle House is when I had an off post pass in Jackson, uh, South Carolina. And I was at Fort Jackson of Columbia. Fort Jackson was the base, but Columbia, South Carolina, people, oh, you gotta go to this. I'm like, what? What's all what's all the fuss? Went to it. I'm like, I get it. I get it. That's right. It's good stuff, and you know, like I love the grits and the collar greens and all that stuff. Like, I'm a guy from Nebraska, and that's my first time having you know some southern comfort food. And I love southern comfort food, that's for sure. So let's get back to it here. I kind of got off on a tangent there, but hey, you kind of done a lot of leadership roles there. And let's talk about like your current role at Walnut Grove High School. You know, when you look at the growth and the success you have, what do you believe has driven the process, the success that you have? Is there something you can say this has kind of you know, kind of spurred that spurred us on to what we're doing today?

Lindsey Allen: 23:38

Well, I've I think it's like with any any leader, it's having clarity of vision. And I think it starts with that. You know, when I started, it was actually April of 2020, right? COVID is when I took the job. What I did was just I met about with about a hundred different people, believe it or not. And I just asked them, what do you like about Walnut Grove? You know, where do you want us to go? What are some things we can improve in? And then I asked them, you know, what do you what questions do you have for me? And all I do is just listen. And the community will tell you what they are wanting to accomplish. And then my job was to craft the vision that married with what the community wanted. And so we were the rally cry for us has been for the past six years, we want all of our students to have a meaningful school experience, to graduate on time, and to leave enrolled, enlisted, andor employed. And so it's those three things. And we perseverate actually on that end part because in the end we realize that high school is not about graduation, that's just a mile marker in their lives. You know, I actually draw, I actually do this with every every kid that comes in our building. I do this talk with them where I draw a line from zero to 80, and I say, guys, that's your life. And then I show them from five to eighteen, that is where you're in school. And I said, look out how much left of that line is left. And I said, This these four years is all you have left. What are you gonna do? Because so much of that's gonna determine what the next part of this line is gonna look like, from the kind of job you have to what your retirement's gonna look like. So we really talk a lot about enrolled enlisted employees. And so I tell them, there's nothing worse than the kid getting a handshake, going down the stairs, and having no idea where they're gonna go. I said you're gonna end up in a low-wage, high demand job. And again, I'm I'm not disparaging you going to those jobs, but I believe you're meant for more than that. And so that's just been that's been our mantra. And when I say meaningful school experience, we talk all about about that. What are the new trends coming around? We we make changes in CTAE all the time. Like, for example, you know, the number one job in the state of Georgia is construction. So we started construction. I talked to my superintendent, he got on board and we build a construction lab. The number two job is health care. Well, we have healthcare science, you know, we have engineering, which is also marries with the construction. So, you know, we we look at those things. And the other part for us, this is something that was a big deal, but I felt we had an inequity was that you know, we have the University of Georgia and Georgia Tech right here at us. Our students were not able to get into those schools because we didn't have enough AP classes. When I walked in Walnut Grove, we offered five AP courses. Well, just the University of Georgia alone, the average number of AP courses that students have taken and gotten, you know, threes or higher is like 10 plus. We only have five. Now, I'm not even talking about Georgia Tech, which is a whole nother ball of wax when you talk about level of rigor. And so, you know, we began to change all a lot of our coursework because again, enrolled and listed or employed, and our kids wanted to get to compete and go to these schools, so we need to provide that meaningful school experience. And so we began to transition to that, and now we offer 18 AP courses in just six years, and that was a big change. I mean, that we moved a lot of people's cheese, but I we got I got a new assistant principal, and I we had one that was already there, and they helped me figure that out. And you know, how does that look? And right now, I mean, we had our largest number of students who were accepted to the University of Georgia as early or early enrollees ever. And that was just two weeks ago in Georgia Tech. We had a ton again. So, but again, they're able to compete with kids around the country and the world where they weren't before. So that's where it comes back to that vision. Everything we do, that is our distillery, does what our decision get us closer to what we're trying to accomplish because that's what the community wants, and how do we do that? So that's that's what I would say. We just that's what we did.

Principal JL: 27:42

Yeah, I think that's great. It kind of like what I really liked is what you did is you came in and you go, What do you guys want to see? What's your vision? And you're able to understand, like, okay, I see where they're at. How can I help that vision come alive? And I think that's really important to point out because you weren't coming in saying, I have all the answers, I have this big vision for everybody. You were listening to the people and going, okay, what do the people want? How can I help get to where we are? And you found solutions to that, and so you're able to just build. And so I think that was really, really great to hear. And you know, great job for doing that. I mean, taking a school that had five AP classes, now you have 18 offerings. I mean, that's a big shift. And I we we have quite a few AP offerings and do credits in our school too. Like, I know it's like it's a big deal to have those things, and that's what draw people in on us because we can offer things schools around us can't. So I think that's really great. And congratulations on making all your little Georgia Tech yellow jackets and bulldogs for future.

Lindsey Allen: 28:52

Uh that's yeah, I'm happy, I'm happy for the yellow jackets, but I really root for my bulldogs, but you know, that's a whole nother thing.

Principal JL: 29:00

That's another we'll get into a conversation maybe at the end here, but I will say that Nebraska stole your offensive line coach from Georgia Tech. So I'm sorry, guys.

Lindsey Allen: 29:09

Yeah, well, they can steal them all. I don't bother me from Georgia Tech.

Principal JL: 29:13

I don't bother you. Yeah, not right now. All right, okay. So, Lindsey, you were named the 2025 principal of the year for the state of Georgia. What was that like? Like, how how did you find out about the the award? You know, was there a big celebration? Was it a phone call? Like, was it a big surprise, or was it kind of just a casual thing? I was just curious how people get notified for these things.

Lindsey Allen: 29:44

Mine was a big surprise. Uh, so my superintendent, who had just been appointed, decided to call a faculty meeting on a Friday afternoon because he wanted to celebrate our staff's results for things we done. I'm going, oh my, are you kidding me? He's doing a and by the way, this was football Friday night. This is not just a regular Friday. I'm like, anyway, so we did it, and the uh GASSP uh president, uh he was there, and so the superintendent brought me on stage, and then he came out, like my family came out, and and you know, they they let me know then. And it was uh it was special. It was special really to be with my staff and my family because you and I both know you don't get those awards without them. And really, I told them there, I said that this award is really more about the sacrifices my family has has is made for me to do this job well, and it's about the staff who believe in what we're trying to accomplish. And it's about the kids who've also bought in as well. So, you know, I I told them, while this is a it's got my name on the award, this is as much everybody in this room as is mine. And uh, I just happen to be the one getting it. And so it was really humbling because I I just know what my 18 years administration, you know, you don't get there if you don't have a supportive wife and a supportive family because you're not there a lot. And you don't get those awards if you don't have a staff that believes in division, that you're cascading and gets behind you and supports you and a community that way. And you know, I you know, I it was again, it's still humbling, truthfully. I wish I could get every one of them an award with their name on it because that award is as much theirs it is mine.

Principal JL: 32:09

Well, that's awesome. I'm glad you got a surprise. I'm really surprised your family was able to keep it from you. Yeah, that doesn't happen very easily.

Lindsey Allen: 32:18

Yeah, I noticed things, man. I'm uh yeah, I'm a detailed person as they would I'll drive them crazy. I'm so detailed, but but uh they were able to pull that one over. It really, my uh my administrative assistant, uh Miss Gibson, she was really the culprit. She was the one and and she's unbelievable. I mean, just unbelievable lady and just uh a great leader of our school, too. But it was really it was really her who was uh this who was able to deceive me to orchestrate everything.

Principal JL: 32:48

Yeah, She's just well that's awesome. So, you know, after being named the principal of the year for the state of Georgia, so what opportunities have opened up for you? So what what is how is that the you know with this recognition, you know, what has that been like for you? It's been a whirlwind. What's what's you know that like for you?

Lindsey Allen: 33:09

Not really a whirlwind. I I think what I I have I don't know how to say this. I guess I would say this way. It's just giving a little more credibility to when I make when I say things. You know, I'm saying like there's a little more weight when I share things, whether it's in the district or in the state or you know, in our community, you know, there's just uh a little bit, a little heaviness if Lindsay says that, you know, well, let's let's consider it or whatever. So, you know, and I leverage that as best I can for Walnut Grove and for Walton County. I think that's one thing. The opportunity, again, to share our story and figure out how I can help other principals. You know, our our principals are struggling, whether they want to admit it or not, but they're struggling. I mean, talking to Dr. Alan Long, who who uh is our president GASSP, he was telling me because there's so many new leaders in our in our in our county, I mean, excuse me, in our school system and in throughout the state. And they don't really have a network of of people to talk to and connect with. So, you know, I've been able to serve as a mentor for some of the assistant principals that are aspiring to be principals and kind of talk through that with that. And so that's that's I've enjoyed that. But I mean, it's I don't know. Uh you know, that's about it. I mean, it's been great. I'm gonna tell you what, going to NASSP, getting to connect with all those state principals, and I mean, you know, like Tony Katani, who is uh the national superintendent, I mean principal of the year in New Jersey. He and I just hit it off probably because I'm married to a New Jersey girl. So I think that helped a little bit. You know, Tony, Matt Epps, you know, over in Alabama, you know, it's just there's so many people that we've just you've been able to connect with and and reach out to. That's that's been really cool. This you know, like you and I met, I I think through Tony. Uh and you know, so that's some of those opportunities. Yeah, I really want to want to build the profession and I want to invest. Again, I told you I got into I got into leadership because I wanted to influence more people. So this is just another platform to to have an opportunity to influence people beyond now, even our state. So, but that's that's probably what I would say.

Principal JL: 35:15

Yeah, that's awesome. I really appreciate you sharing that. And yeah, Tony Katani, I actually met him. I was actually out in Seattle for the NASSP National Convention there, and so that was a really good time. But actually listened to the podcast he did with Darrin Peppard leaning into leadership because he was doing all the national finalists for the NASSP, um, middle school, high school contestants. And so I listened to his and he talked about this peer observation thing. And so I had the opportunity to meet Tony um in person. I had him on my podcast, and he's like, Hey, this is be somebody, you know, here's some people, you know, because we really enjoy just sharing other people's stories. And my thing is I learn, you know, the great things that you're doing, and I learn from that. Is there something I could steal from Lindsay Allen? Probably. I'm gonna figure that out tonight. So uh so that's kind of what we do, right? And so just being a part of this podcast and having you on to help other leaders get those insights, and I think another thing is also confirmation, right? Hey, I'm doing some of the same things that these people are doing, so I'm on the right track. So it gets you excited about what you're doing. So I think that's important as well. You kind of talked about helping, you know, people in you know, new leadership, right? People that are coming into the job. What advice would you give to aspiring administrators?

Lindsey Allen: 36:43

I I'd probably start with Abraham Lincoln. He he once said that you're not a leader when you get the title, you should have been leader before you got it. And so what I I see a lot of people want the position, but they really didn't prepare themselves for the position. Like, you know, experience is a brutal teacher. It is a brutal teacher. And my my view is the best leaders, they do a few things. Number one, they read. You know, Harry Truman says not all readers are leaders, but all leaders are readers. And I I can tell you, and my staff will tell you, you won't you won't outread me. So I might not be the brightest crayon in the box, but I can tell you this: you're not gonna outread me. I'm gonna read research, I'm gonna look at leadership books, I'm gonna continually try to build my capacity because I believe in the law of the lid, to quote John Maxwell. And as far as I've gone is as far as I can take anybody else. So I think it's behooves anybody who wants to get into leadership. It is your responsibility to develop yourself. And that starts number one with reading. And number two is to find somebody who's doing it well and become their friend. And, you know, my pastor says this way he goes, tell me who the five people, who your who their closest five friends are, and what you're reading, and I'll tell you where you'll be in 10 years. Because what you read and who you're around are going to influence you, they're gonna influence how you think, what your beliefs are gonna be, what your values are gonna be. And I just can't express enough how important it is to get around people who are doing the job and doing it well, because a wise man learns from experience, a wiser man learns from other people's experience, and it sure is a whole lot less painful. So those are the two things I would tell them. And and they sound simple, but I I can't tell you. I mean, I I can't tell you. I I ask all the time the people that I mentor to what book are you reading? You know how many people have told me a leadership book?

Principal JL: 38:42

Oh, how many? Zero.

Lindsey Allen: 38:45

Not one.

Principal JL: 38:46

We're not talking about. I think that might be my next interview question when I have to bring in a new administrator. Well, how are you personally uh growing? So I think that's really important to hit on because I think, you know, like you said, you know, yeah, you go through college, you get the administrative degree, but there's there's more to it than just theory and what you may think you're gonna have to do when you actually gotta be in the mix of it and actually doing the job. And so when you learn from people that have actually done it and they've done it well, I think that's really important to understand because that's kind of what I'm learning, you know, doing this podcast. I've learned from so many different people, but I'm able to get ideas because I'm not shrinking, my box isn't shrunk. It's like I've expanded the people that I've connected with, but that's helped me grow personally. And I'm, you know, and I'm hearing you say some of the same things here is like, you know, hey, I'm gonna expand my network, I'm gonna learn from other people and and things like that. So if there's a leadership book that you have read that you would, you know, you know, not you know, endorse, but what leadership book would you say, hey, this would be a great one for you to think about? Oh my god. You know, and I and there's still there's a lot of them out there, but I just want to know one.

Lindsey Allen: 40:07

Well, you know, I tell people is tell me what you want to get better at. And that's what I that's what if if they're talking about just general leadership knowledge, I tell them to go read John Maxwell's Developing Leader Within You 2.0. That is a great broad overview. If you're looking at, you know, leadership laws, you know, you do John Maxwell's 21 laws of irrefutable laws of leadership. If you're looking at how to develop teams, go read Patrick Lencioni's, you know, five dysfunctions of a team. Uh, if you're looking at hiring, go read Patrick Lencioni's I'd say Ideal team player. That's a great book. If you if you're what if you're thinking about getting to leadership, go read The Motive by Patrick Lencioni. As you he has got so many leadership books, and I'm they're not education-based in any way, but they're about leadership. Go read those. I'm reading a book right now called Influence. If you want to under try to better understand that what we do in our job is about uh influencing the behavior of adults.

Principal JL: 41:06

Well, you're heading on something there. I might have to check this one out.

Lindsey Allen: 41:09

Yeah, it is it is actually I was I was actually coaching up my assistant principal today about that. One of those it's in chapter two about reciprocation and the power of reciprocation and how to leverage that, you know. And I and I gave her the example in the book where this this this uh I think it was a Scott Psychologist, just to prove the point, sent out a bunch of Christmas cards to people he didn't know. And you wouldn't believe how many of them send them Christmas cards back because of the power of reciprocation and how you could, you know, how you can leverage that. And you know, so but understanding that we as what we do as leaders is we're trying to influence adults to go to a place they probably don't want to go, and sometimes we've got to know how to do that because pedagogy, which is the practice of teaching, is very different than andragogy, which is about adult learning theory. And what we do is we put leaders from teachers into administrators, and they are still trying to use pedagogy with adults and it doesn't work. Androgogy is a very different concept, and so that's that's what I would say is uh again, there are lots of great leadership. I could keep go all day about leadership books, it just depends again. What you're trying to hone in on. But if you're just trying to start out, hey, I just want just want to start, I would tell you, you know, do the developing leader within you 2.0. Another book I would say when it comes to leaders, a lot of leaders don't know themselves well. They don't know what their strengths are and don't know that they should know their strengths so they can leverage those so they know their blind spots. They hire with your blind spots. And but if you don't know what your your strengths are, well, go to Strengths Finder 2.0 by Gallup, and that'll give you kind of your strengths and kind of understand why you do what you do and how you leverage those strengths. Like I'm an achiever. So, you know, you talked about how I talked about meetings. Well, I'm an achiever. You don't want to ask me to a meeting unless it has a purpose. I'll call someone else. And so, but but but I know that about myself, if that makes sense. I'm also my number one is a learner. As you can see, I like to read, so I leverage that. So, but I'm not Mr. Woo hugging everybody. So, you know, that's one of the strengths.

Principal JL: 43:20

Yeah, I know the woos. I know exactly what you're talking about because I've actually done that strength finder, and we've actually done it here at our district with all our admin a couple years ago. I actually did it when I was in my leadership academy when I was at my what Ralston High School. I worked with Dr. Adler, he did it there. I did it again um within my first couple of years here, and I go, Well, I'll redo it because you know things have changed, and they did. My leadership style has grown since you know I've been a principal when I started eight years ago up to now. And so I really think you know revisiting those things. We started saying woo because we have a guy that was a woo, and we always like, yeah, that's your woo coming out.

Lindsey Allen: 44:49

I didn't say yeah, I have Coach Cochran and I have Dr. Branley, and they are both woo. I am not woo. And uh, but but you know, I hired that way. I mean, I knew my team and I knew what I'm not, and that's another thing the administrators don't realize is the principal hires that to compliment their team. It's about the it's about the principal. It's really they don't realize that it's about you because you're the chief leader of that school, and you gotta know what you do well so you don't overhire what you already are good at and hire a bunch of you, hire people that aren't like you and they can compliment your your where your blind spots are so you can shrink that blind spot. And you know, and again, I could keep going, man. I mean, the other one I tell them to take the disc assessment, which is about your personality, you know, it is just so many things. Like I said, so I can go all day about what they should read or what they should do. And and again, the the more you know about yourself, better off you're gonna be as a leader.

Principal JL: 45:49

You bet. And I appreciate all the things that you have mentioned there, because there's a lot of great advice in there about you know, wanting to get in the leadership, knowing who you are, you know, how do you work? Because I think that's really important because that helps inform you so you can make better decisions. And I really like the thing that you pointed out about getting staff around you that aren't you, because that's kind of what I did when I had an assistant principal to hire. I wanted to find somebody that had certain things, but also had strengths that I don't have. Like, oh, this person can do this. This is you know, there you go, buddy. You know, you can do these things, and I'll continue to do these things, but you know, the have you know things complement each other is really important because we all have our strengths, and I think that's really important for people to know and understand of when they're in that role as well. So I really appreciate you pointing that out as well. So, future of education, what gets you really excited about when you think about you know the future of education? I know a lot of people are doom and gloom in education right now, but let's talk about some positive. Let's talk about something that maybe you know gets you excited about the future.

Lindsey Allen: 47:02

I mean, uh it I'm excited about AI. We've been we've been talking about it for almost three years now. I mean, well, two and a half years now. When when I I tell you, I saw the Khan Academy video and and I got to watch Khan talk about what he was doing with AI, with open AI on that TED talk. I I just realized for the first time ever, we're really going to be able to individualize instruction at some point in time. And that was exciting to me because again, I taught for 10 years and I had 30 kids in my Algebra one class and trying to give them feedback and trying to meet all their needs and all the different levels, you know, it and throwing out the worst different instruction and all this other stuff. Basically, you want me to be multiple of me to try to meet it. Well, AI is gonna be able to do that. Um, and I believe that if done well, our teachers are gonna be able to have a tool that'll help individualize instruction. I mean, I'm already, you know, so what we did is we actually leveraged, we knew how they were gonna respond. We stood, I started talking to them about it, immediately they go to, well, they're gonna be able to cheat. And so we didn't leverage that. We leveraged time. Again, you know, I'm all about time for my staff. So we showed them how they could get time back. And when I started getting some of my best and veteran teachers, uh starting to realize I don't have to spend 10 hours doing a rubric, I can get it done in two minutes, you know. And uh they they began to realize. So I'm excited for that. I think that's gonna help, it's gonna give some time back to our teachers so they can have normal lives as best they can at home and be able to leave some stuff at work. You know, also, I mean, it's it's a I'm excited because it's a companion. You know, think about you and I. We went to we went to college, we're writing these lesson plans and trying to figure all this stuff out. Man, you've now got you've now got a white-collar worker that's an expert that can help you figure out the best pedagogical methodology of how to deliver this lesson or give you some ideas about what that might look like, or to help you find resources that are that could be at your fingertips. So that's what I'm excited about. I'm excited about it a tool to help our teachers get some time back and also to improve them, you know, themselves. So that's what I'm excited about.

Principal JL: 49:18

I think you mentioned something really important there. You said tool, yeah, like it's a tool that we can use to leverage and see. And I've hear people like, oh my gosh, AI is the worst thing in the world, you know, all these things are gonna happen. And but if you utilize the tool correctly, like AI needs a person to prompt it, AI needs the person to tell it what to do, it can't just do whatever it wants. And so something that we did last spring is we piloted the magic school AI platform and my teachers, and I sold it with I sold it with, hey, this will help you differentiate instruction, this will help you save time, and that's how I leveraged it, just like you just talked about. And so when they started seeing it and I started asking questions, they really enjoyed it. Even some of my, you know, like you said, teachers that have been doing this for a while, were like, Oh wow, this really does help me able to do my job better because I'm able to do these things. I would take me hours to do, and so even like my English teacher being able to differentiate instruction, she was like, Man, I'm able to save so much time now because I have a tool, and so then we went ahead and we got the you know, the the full package we're in the enterprise package um for my building. I'm trying to get my district to pay for it, but that's another story. But we're utilizing it, it's really working well. You know, I I found some money in my budget and I was able to get it, but at the same time, the staff has used it really well, they used it to leverage to get time back, and they really, really like if they don't, it's one of those things you give them something, there's no way I can take it away from them now because it's something that they they go, you know what, this is something we needed, even though they didn't realize it. And I was just like, I don't want to push anything on you, but I'm gonna give you an opportunity to leverage something that not a lot of people have done. I think we were the third high school in the state of Nebraska that leveraged that tool, and I think there's a lot more schools now starting to get on board with it. So I think you know, AI is here to stay. We might as figure out a way to leverage it to help us and not worry about what it's you know, it's gonna take jobs. I don't think it's gonna take jobs, I think it's gonna make us better. And that's I I really appreciate you saying that.

Lindsey Allen: 51:36

Well, we had I'll say this for your for your listeners we had a speaker come and he said AI is not gonna take your job. The person who understands how to use AI is gonna take your job, and that's that's what you need to understand.

Principal JL: 51:48

Bingo, bingo, you're right on that. So, hey man, this has been a lot of fun. I mean, I've really enjoyed getting to listen to your story and learn from you today. So, what's next for you? What you got some things coming up, you got some things in the fire, you know. You know, I know you're the principal at Walnut Grove High School, but you know what what's next for for Lindsey Allen coming up?

Lindsey Allen: 52:12

You know, I really don't to be honest with you, right now it's gonna be the principal Walnut Grove High School. You know, I we you know it's hard, you know how it is. It's hard to predict the future in education. You don't know what's gonna come around the corner, you don't know who's gonna, you know, what what opportunities may open up. But my my my most immediate plans are to continue to be the principal of Walnut Grove High School. I have my last last kid graduating this year. I'll have give all all giving all three of my kids their diploma. And I've got my first grandkid due in May, so I'm excited about that. So that that may play into what I do next. But uh, but right now my most immediate focus is gonna be can getting ready for next year, which you know, right on the corner will be getting ready for next year.

Principal JL: 52:57

Already planning it.

Lindsey Allen: 52:58

Yeah, exactly. So a lot of people don't realize that good principles are six months ahead. So we're already thinking about summer within my summer planning. We're thinking about you know what are we looking at next year already, and uh so right now that's my that's what I plan to do right now.

Principal JL: 53:12

Well, I want to say congratulations on becoming a grandpa. I'm a grandpa too, I have almost a three-year-old granddaughter, so it's a lot of fun. It was one of those surprise things. I'm like, I'm too young to be a grandpa. I was a grandpa at what age 44.

Lindsey Allen: 53:28

I got yeah, you know, and I'm just like, really?

Principal JL: 53:30

Like that's supposed to be like 50 or 60 or something, but it's a blessing. So I'll be honest with you, being a grandparent is so much better. Yeah, well, it's better to be like spoil them and kick them back. See ya. I've heard that, I've heard that quite a bit. Yeah, no, you'll enjoy it. And I and I say, Yeah, I enjoy that the grandkid when it comes for sure. And congratulations on that. So, Lindsay, you know, we've been talking a lot. You know, people are really interested in the things you're doing and want to get connect with you. How could people do that?

Lindsey Allen: 54:04

I just tell people to email me. I that's how people have been reaching out, and I mean I'll respond that way. And uh my uh email is Lindsay L-I-N-D-S E Y dot allen a l-l-en at walton.k twelve dot g a dot us. And it you can go also go to the Walnut Grove High School website, and uh you can also see my uh email there, and you can email me directly from that as well. But you know, I'm I'm happy to help if I anywhere I can or share anything I can. Uh we we we we're you know, I believe it I'm a learner and I'm and I'm a teacher all the time. So I'm uh I try to share whatever, I try to learn from as much of people as I can as many people as I can. I'm the sum of the of the people I've been around in my lifetime. And so I believe it's my responsibility to share as much as I can and invest where I can.

Principal JL: 54:54

Awesome. I appreciate that. And we will have that information in the show notes so you guys can just scroll down and grab his email and connect with Lindsay here. So Lindsay, it was great having you on the show. And before we go, do you have any last things you'd like to say?

Lindsey Allen: 55:10

I I just, you know, I I just a firm believer in public education. I'll tell you that. That was a that's my platform. You know, I believe you can't remain both ignorant and free. And uh I am to quote one of our founding fathers. And so I am a big proponent of public education, and uh I believe that public education can solve so many of our problems in our country, and I believe it's the foundation of our country. And uh I appreciate all educators who've put their hand to the plow and every day get up and go to try to make a difference in kids' lives and their communities. And and I I sincerely appreciate that and and thank you.

Principal JL: 55:45

Well, thank you, Alan, for all you do as well. So I'm gonna go ahead and let you go. I'll talk to you soon. What an awesome conversation with Mr. Lindsey Allen. If today's episode gave you insight, encouragement, or spark you needed, share it with another educator or leader in your circle. And don't forget to subscribe to this podcast so you never miss another impactful conversation like this one. Until next time, be curious and one percent better.